Every time we play sd_force, and the red team wins... at the end of the map the whole other team gets arty and goes and camps in the spawn. forcing the other team to exploit the map to enter so that we can end the map. in my opinion this interfers with regular gameplay and pisses everyone off. lowering the amount of players on the server. i think it would be a good idea to start enforcing a rule that stops people from doing this. lemme knwo if you agree or disagree, and what we can do about it...

I disagree. I like being able to put up an, "Alamo". I think it adds allot of fun into the game. If you ever play blue on that map, you know that camping it out in there until the enevitable happens is great fun. Man.. I love doing that.. Geesh..

yes i agree with sam gen all the way, the only reason i love that map is waitin to the end and holding up an alamo, it gives me an adrenaline pump every time i morter 4 people in a row

I too have to agree with Sam.Gen. and AZNTWON5 . . . it's more of a rush to see what will happen at the very end of the map and waiting to use mortar to get the reds who are trying to get into spawn. The only thing that is dumb with blue spawn is that when the reins run out we (Blue) can't get to the only ammo box which isn't fair because the red side has an ammo box in their spawn area. But getting back on topic it doesn't bother me just keeping trying running into blues spwan at the very end it's fun to see who can get through :wink:

I like it too, it's a lot of fun and these last stands are often the best in a round :)And just for the record red team is doing it the same way (with a nice ammo box) and I don't care if they do, because I know they will and I would too......So I would say stop complaining and just play the game and if you don't like the end just wait or leave until the next map starts.[DIAL]Doc

I agree. I like playing the Alamo role on both sides. It gives a unique challenge that I enjoy. Doc, the Red ammo box is really useless at the end of the round. It is exposed to both entrances and I've been gunned down several times going on an ammo trip.

Simple fact: Exploits are an issue of 'fairness'.

 

Simple fact: It is impossible to monitor the use of supposed 'expoits', and to prevent their use - much less objectively determine what is truely an 'exploit' and what is just a hapless use of game features and movement that incidentally brings an advantage (ie: crouchstrafe..).

 

Simple fact: It is therefore the most 'fair' for all 'fundamental' exploits to be allowed - which is inherently perfectly fair, because then anyone can do them, and there is nothing to whine about.

 

Simple fact: Having people constantly whining about exploits, people exploiting, and having constant argumentation over the issue is FAR more detrimental to a person's game experience than the 'moral stress' of having to learn and do them yourselves.

 

Simple fact: An exploit is in the eye of the beholder. Some people would consider my looping around maps and constantly coming from behind 'exploiting'. Some people get aggrivated because I wait for them to come to me, and don't rush at them like a blind ninny like so many other people do.

 

Simple fact: Regardless of whether 'exploits' exist or not, people are always going to find something to whine about. Especially when they're not winning. CS is a perfect example of this - go play on a cs pub... all you'll see is 'Camping @#$(*' '@#$(* awpers' .. all day long.

 

Simple fact: The only way to make a FA players game experience as good as possible IS to provide for an even baseline. What this means is, 'exploits' which cannot be objectively determined and proved on a consistent basis (ie, movement exploits) are allowed. This is the only way to ensure perfect fairness - everyone can do them, so nobody has anything to WHINE about.

 

Simple fact: 2.9 is out shortly, and one can only hope that some, albeit it is unlikely all, of these 'exploits' are resolved by the game programmers - who should be the ones responsible for them - as opposed to server administrators who simply should not have to put up with this crap.

 

Thanks.

 

What do I tell people when I'm accused of exploiting?

 

I tell them, if nobody did it I wouldn't, however - other people do, and instead of whining, I'd rather learn to 'exploit' (aka. USE) the inherent features of the game to the greatest advantage myself - then it's FAIR. Learning to exploit / maintaining fairness > whining and bitching.

Got this from thread on same subject. Best answer I've read on subject. Is clear and clarifies once and for all thatallwing exploits for all to learn and use makes more sense and is more fair than the impossible act of trying to police every single fa player... indeed...an impossible task.

Your right Gator....broken record....gets old....

IT'S IN THE GAME, DEAL WITH IT

IT'S IN THE GAME, DEAL WITH IT

AND THEN EAT SOME X-TREME JELLO!!!

Me I find that the camping is not well, look at has Durandal in the sewers. One should distribute has several players of the blue team an aunt lol. :mrgreen: WT.

JUST DONT CAMP THE SPAWN NUBS

NUBS = ??????? Lol if you want to talk about the new players I already saw good players it done lol. WT.

On sd_force, it doesn't have to be an automatic win for red. The blue team has to do only one thing to chang it. Guard the crates. One blue player guarding the crates can make it a 'blue win'. I've done it - it works

Yes can be but sd_force is an attak card pur :? Therefore is not itself funny for the others to see players to camp to the sniper. One does a step outside of the basis of the red ones and one is dead. :shock: Play as that, his does not give anymore envies it to play WT.

I look forward to the end of the sd_force map also. It is great fun bombing the guys that run into the square at the end. I am not a newb even though most of the time I play like one. What are we supposed to do, run out and get killed by 15 waiting red or blue players. Makes more sense to hide out than to get shot. The only time it is not fun for me is when I get killed and can't be part of it. I just wait patiently for the next map and the next chance to die. LOL Just my opinion.Klink out!

I disagree with all that agree to say this campign is fun. Camping to make this "alamo" is not fun. When you're KIA you wait for the other map... and sometimes you wait 15 minutes... It's not funny to see people using mortars / grenades / m79 only just to have an "alamo".It's the same on Iwojima, Desertcrisis and so on. The losing team is always camping in base, sniping or using grenades / mortars. This makes neverending maps. Boring. You're just here and wait that a lucky nade will kill them (Iwojima) or to success in exploiting to get into spawn (Iwojima and Force) or just a good rush (Desercrisis). Really boring. No tactic. Just a kamikaze attack. Where is the fun ? killing the most enemies as you can before being killed ? this is not a war, it's a game ! everyone wants to have fun ! So please stop doing things that annoy players... you can make and create maps to have a real "alamo". Objectives to defend the fort for one team while the other as to enter it. Simply as that. But don't play "alamo" at map's ending when everyone KIA wants to play on the other map. No matters which team wins the map, we are not in a FAL match, we are trying to have fun. For everyone. Not for only 8 players on the map... think to the other players sometimes.It's a game. Who wins doesn't matter. The point is that everyone has fun.

Let me see.... some say they have fun while making a last stand. You, Arhnayel, are saying this game is about having fun. Hmmmmm.... am I missing something here? :? I, too, get a little annoyed at the time spent while waiting. But I see that as my problem :shock: at being impatient :evil: and not, in myself, allowing others to play out the map in their own time and in their own way. I think all maps have a time limit , and even with these last stands, I don't think I have ever seen a map exceed its alloted time when the server is full. Most maps with 20-26 players are over long before the map time runs out.

I like it, when reins are gone, some snipers are in the enemy base.. My teammates run into their fire and somehow, with many many luck, i will be able to cap....... HEHEHEH

Im fixing it for 3.0

Every time we play sd_force, and the red team wins... at the end of the map the whole other team gets arty and goes and camps in the spawn. forcing the other team to exploit the map to enter so that we can end the map. in my opinion this interfers with regular gameplay and pisses everyone off. lowering the amount of players on the server. i think it would be a good idea to start enforcing a rule that stops people from doing this. lemme knwo if you agree or disagree, and what we can do about it...

Agreed

I just said what I said : this game is to have fun for everyone, not only few people. When there are only 8 players on a map camping and 18 others KIA... it's annoying for them, even if they are patient, and they are the many. And even when I stand still in the last 8 players, I try to end as soon as possible the map. I see no fun in camping just to try to win when all is lost. Better is to switch to another map, for everyone plays as soon as possible on a server they like. I know some as fun in the last stand, but when the last stand is just "mortars / sniping / camping"... well, I have no fun in... that's all. Each player plays this game his / her way, but sometimes we could do a little effort to play like the many wants to. It's why I'm patient waiting for the map to end. But I dislike it.This post was to agree or disagree on a rule to stop people doing the last stand. It's a good idea, but not the best. Adding maps specially maked for "alamo" is also a good idea I think. The combinaison of the two is a better idea. But still not the best. You're the admins / SC, it's your job to find ideas and make them real, or not. We, players, are just here to tell our ideas, complaints and suggestions. We do it, that's all. (I don't mean to offense, sorry if someone has been offensed by reading what I wrote. I just tell what I think.)

Well, it's fun when reds know what they should do (grouping out of the mortar range and then rush). When half of the team is standing 'somewhere' on the map, 1/3 of the team waiting the crates to reappear to get some cheap points and 2-3 players TRYING to get inside, screaming via mics or typing in capitals, asking for help, it's not fun at all... Hey, I can be the first one to enter (and die) I don't care (that much) about my score... Usually at this moment of the game the reds are 100% winners and KIA blues want to play another map (don't we all, in fact???) but as I mentioned above the red team doesn't play like the TEAM in that moment.I would rather prefer to end the games like that (when one team outnumbers in reinfs the other) in really close fighting- using knives, forks, clubs, bats, etc. etc. whatever u have in your close range arsenal. Final words: it's OK, but only when reds (on sd_force) know what should be done and execute it. When I die because someone inside choose the right moment to fire a mortar I really laugh like mad but when we can't finish the map because red team doesn't want to finish it's annoying.

Not much we can do about this. Its part of the game and its pretty simple to overcome

it may be fun for those that like ot get arty and camp in the spawn... but in my opinion it interferes with regular gameplay... esspecially when there are 20minutes left on the map... the point of having a public server is for people to play on it... and if people leave because of this... then it is interfering with gameplay... at the end of a map i want to play the next map... i dont wanna wait 20min for the map to end... id rather go play on another server.. and it seems to be the same attitude as a lot of people... and honestly i have never seen any team camp in there and come back and win... unless the other team was under 10 reins and couldnt get boxes in time before the idiots sat there and got hammers by morter... while playing on the TA server you see a message pop up saying "do not interfer with gameplay" and in my opinion this does interfer with gameplay and pisses people off. so i just ask the players of the TA server... unless its possible to win... please do not camp the spawn whena team has 50 reins and there are 20min left... if theres 5 minutes left and u wanna camp morter to get your score good.. thats fine... but dont be rude about it... end the map and let us play the game... thank you all for your in-put. see you in game